Vote: How Much Are You Prepared To Spend On Hardware For Live Contest Qualifier?

As the plans of this year's live competitions are being unfolded, the ever-returning question and complaints of the large capital investment needed for even participating in the qualification phase of the competitions are becoming a topic as well. In an attempt to provide vendors or organisations with a statistical argument to lower the entry cost for the live competitions, we are hosting a voting poll which allows you to speak your mind on the cost to participate. The question is simple:

"How Much Are You Prepared To Spend On Hardware For Live Contest Qualifier?"

Please only include the necessary component cost when you cast your vote. This includes: motherboard, processor and graphics card. It excludes: binning hardware, memory, liquid nitrogen, electricity, food and so on. For example if you would be willing to spend EUR €500 on hardware, you could be looking at a Core i7 3570K (€190), Z77A-GD65 (€140) and Radeon HD 7850 (€170). We ask you to only include these components because those usually define the minimum requirements to participate.

You can find the voting poll on your right-hand side in the sidebar on every page. In order to vote, you need to have made at least five submissions at HWBOT and of course be logged in. Also feel free to provide feedback and other insight as comment on this newspost. The more info, the better!


42

Belgium Massman says:

... and yes, this vote actually has an effect on upcoming qualifiers :)

United States Mikecdm says:

Is this for something such as MOA. I'm sure the cost of actual hardware to participate isn't the issue. The issue is that of binning. That's where "having a chance" really comes to play. Its not about just having the lightning card or the necessary cpu and motherboard. A good majority of us could all buy those.

Australia Jimba says:

MSI and others really need to do something to get new people into MOA and stuff like GOOC (if that is coming back?) it seems to be the same guys every year with a few changes. time to fresh it up a bit,get some new people out there..:D im not just saying this because I really want to go to MOA..:p

Netherlands wesjuhdabomb says:

It depends.. I usually keep up with hardware, meaning I already have a 3770k + motherboard and will probably also upgrade to Haswell when that is available.

For a big competition I would be willing to spend something, but if it will be an 'all out' stage/compo it would cost me +- 900 euro (GTX Titan) to be competitive which is way to much. In that regard I would say max €250,- on additional costs.

Denmark zzolio says:

if we are 2 people to pay then 2000 euro max
there has to be money to ln2

so Titan and 3930K S.2011 motherboard and RAM is probably too much

Eeky NoX says:

Jimba said: MSI and others really need to do something to get new people into MOA and stuff like GOOC (if that is coming back?)

it seems to be the same guys every year with a few changes. time to fresh it up a bit,get some new people out there..:D





im not just saying this because I really want to go to MOA..:p


And "sometimes" there isn't even no qualifier... just same ppl gat free ticket! (here I speek for Turkmenistan ofc ^^)


+/- 250€ looks doable yup.


Edit: The guy inside this post is a liar!!

United States Splave says:

$16 USD max

GENiEBEN says:

Splave said: $16 USD max


That beer pack sure comes in handy when you already have the hardware :celebration:

K404 says:

Don't do live competitions, so answer = 0 for me.

Germany der8auer says:

I'm only a student so 500 € max here.

United States Splave says:

GENiEBEN said: That beer pack sure comes in handy when you already have the hardware :celebration:


this post sponsored by Hoegaarden

"While Hoegaarden represents a style that's clearly not for everyone, this is a classic for those who prefer their beers unfiltered and less bitter."

United States Planet says:

About tree fiddy

United States Splave says:

two fiddy

Iran samt.bsb says:

about two years ago the 350$ was about 1/3 of my monthly pay and now that's all of my pay.the important thing for Iranian overclocker today is the value of national money.this only all of our problem.

United States [GF]Duke says:

$1.00

Norway knopflerbruce says:

If you exclude memory, you might as well exclude mobos - cheap mobos aren't that bad these days. You can still compete fairly well using a rather low-end motherboard. Or am I missing the point here? :) the actual costs come from the CPU and GPU you want to use.

Colombia saint19 says:

Well.

I currently have a 377K and GTX 680 Lightning that was bought with my credit card, so, aren't cheap in any way.

I would not see problem is look for the money for a mobo for those qualifiers but why not be honest? Few monsth ago I saw guys over here buying 10 CPUs for a contest while many of us only can buy 1 CPU and cross the fingers for get it good. I would say that $400-500 USD are the limit for me.

At the end, the guys with more hardware (and money) will get the tickets for the finals, I enter anyway to see that I can do in a big competition like MOA.

Italy Gigioracing says:

retrocloking is better for cash

Australia Jimba says:

the same guys every year should teach the new guys so it is new blood in the sport..:D get rid of the old farts..:p

Belgium Massman says:

knopflerbruce said: If you exclude memory, you might as well exclude mobos - cheap mobos aren't that bad these days. You can still compete fairly well using a rather low-end motherboard. Or am I missing the point here? :) the actual costs come from the CPU and GPU you want to use.


There usually is a mainboard brand restriction for this type of competitions, so it is a cost you need to take into account.

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

I checked "Whatever it takes..."

But for me the most important factor is HARDWARE AVAILABILITY, if someone can't buy needed HW in his country he is bunnyed (cause getting HW from abroad can cause many problems - customs, fast shippings are very expensive and so on).

If hw will be cheap (like GTX 660), there is a big chance that this hw will be very fragile and die, cause those parts are not properly designed for LN2. In addition, there will be MASS BINNING. Last year I bought a lot of Lightnings 7970 for MOA (7 pieces), in that price I would buy 20 GTX 660? something like that. And what will binning shit hw bring? Nothing serious. Binned GTX 660 is only for HW points and that's all, big loss of money, no one what's it, no needed for WR. It will be binning only to get a ticket. Last year binning created WRs and few persons got golden cards which were in TOP up to Titan's launchday. Moreover, there were more 4x GPUs results cause people bought those GPUs and used them for results. If there will be a cheap hw - binning is a real lose of money.

But this time we have Titan, which needs serious hardmods. I think it will be a good test for real overclockers. MOA Final isn't for people who 3-4 times per year use LN2, on single GPU configuration and don't have too much experience, are afraid of vmods. MOA Final is for TOP, for those who are devoted to it, spend a lot of time and private $ (that's why Vendors employees are not allowed to participate), sacrifice other things to test/buy hw and are good about it. OC isn't free (HW is expensive, ln2 also) but it's a hobby. If someone can't keep up with others in terms of HW, he has to stop complaining and do his job (overclock what he can afford).

Making MOA or other qualifier with a cheaper hw will create:

- extreme mass binning and those who can only efford 1-2 GTX 660 will not qualify again cause those "TOP" ocers will efford 10-20 GTX 660
- maybe more person will try to participate, but I think that when few of "TOP" overclockers will present a picture of 20 GTX 660, those few "regular" overclockers will stop participating
- cheaper hw - less OC friendly, extreme mods like Epowers and so on, again regular guys will not qualify
- there will be always ocers/reviewers who get free hw from MSI so they are ahead everyone

I really wonder if MOA Final/other Final is a place for regular overclockers (those who can only afford cheap hw/play with it)? I don't count myself as "PRO" overclocker, but I had a really good year in 2012 and got some nice results. But I know that I always wanted to be in TOP and I was doing everything to find my way in, I admired crazy moddings and other "magic" and extreme TOP was MY inspiration

I prefer to bin hw which I will use for global WR, 4x gpu setups and other benchmarks for PRO OC Cup than bin 660 GTX or other shits to get the ticket and later sell with $ loss those which survived and send a big box of dead hw for RMA

Netherlands wesjuhdabomb says:

Xtreme Addict said:

- maybe more person will try to participate, but I think that when few of "TOP" overclockers will present a picture of 20 GTX 660, those few "regular" overclockers will stop participating
- cheaper hw - less OC friendly, extreme mods like Epowers and so on, again regular guys will not qualify

Counting myself as an overclocker with limited budget (I like the hobby, but not spending 900€ on a gpu for pure OC..), I rather have a qualifier where I atleast have a chance and can set a score (knowing I will most probalby not win) than only looking to others and admiring their mods on a 900€ card.

Also hardware that is less OC friendly should not be the limiting factor. If OCers do not spend a lot of money on their hobby, does not mean that they do not know what they are doing. And if they don't know what they are doing, they can always learn from it?


Just saying, there are a lot of (medium)skilled overclockers that would like to participate because they like overclocking, and not because they can spend a lot of money.

K404 says:

I would rather push a £60 VGA right to the edge than a £400 VGA. I would rather bin 6-7 cards than 1.

There is no RMA. We are OVERCLOCKING IT WITH HIGH VOLTAGE UNDER LN2. MAYBE AFTER REMOVING THE PWM AND REPLACING IT WITH EPOWER/ZOMBIE.

If I am buying certain parts for a competition, it doesn't matter what they are- global points or hardware- I'm entering a competition for the prize. I can get global points as a "consolation prize" or hardware points and maybe some top-5 results. Either way: it's something.

At the moment, keeping things 100% top-end might be good for vendor marketing.... but it's not good for getting new people interested.

"spend 1000 euros on a competition you are not going to win" Tell me why I should do that.

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

K404 said: I would rather push a £60 VGA right to the edge than a £400 VGA. I would rather bin 6-7 cards than 1.

There is no RMA. We are OVERCLOCKING IT WITH HIGH VOLTAGE UNDER LN2. MAYBE AFTER REMOVING THE PWM AND REPLACING IT WITH EPOWER/ZOMBIE.

If I am buying certain parts for a competition, it doesn't matter what they are- global points or hardware- I'm entering a competition for the prize. I can get global points as a "consolation prize" or hardware points and maybe some top-5 results. Either way: it's something.

At the moment, keeping things 100% top-end might be good for vendor marketing.... but it's not good for getting new people interested.

"spend 1000 euros on a competition you are not going to win" Tell me why I should do that.


Oh come on, let's be honest - SHOW ME ONE OVERCLOCKER WHO DOESN'T SEND HW FOR RMA, even after LN2... of course if hw has warranty. I am not talking about old school overclockers, which buy and overclock old hw without warranty because it's too old.

If you don;t want to spend 1000 euro on competition - it's your choice. But there are guys which will spend more for it.

I only spoke for myself - it was my opinion. I prefer to spend more on high ends which I will use than on shits which I will not use - remember that I was in PRO OC League and now I am in PRO OC Cup. I can go to XOC but I don;t like downgrading. And I also made a point that I think that making qualifier on cheap hw will not change anything. In my opinion all "old faces" will be qualified and I don't think that much more new faces will try to qualify. But maybe I am wrong. I will do everything I can to qualify to each event, cause I like those and there are for me the biggest prizes for OC. Meeting up with friends from all over the world and so on. So for me it's no big difference if I will play with cheap cards or highends, but I prefer highends. But I have one condition for me - HW MUST be available to buy or I have to get samples to be able to participate.

Australia Uncle Fester says:

Massman said: There usually is a mainboard brand restriction for this type of competitions, so it is a cost you need to take into account.


Lets be serious if its msi u need to buy 5 boards in hope of qualifying as your sure to kill everyone of them.... Just look at moa thread last year. Lol.

As to how mucb id spend.... Calculate this,
The exact amount that xyala and trouffman spend when u go to a night club with them......

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

uncle fester said: Lets be serious if its msi u need to buy 5 boards in hope of qualifying as your sure to kill everyone of them.... Just look at moa thread last year. Lol.

As to how mucb id spend.... Calculate this,
The exact amount that xyala and trouffman spend when u go to a night club with them......


That';s what I am talking about - cheaper hw - more dead hw. The same with VGAs...

Z77A-GD65 (the highest model for MOA EMEA) - death toll was extreme. This board isn't good for LN2. But Bing Bang Xpower II is a very tough board, I still have my first sample which I got for MOA 2012 Grand Final and I overclocked on it a lot, before Grand Final, during Grand Final, after Grand Final and it's still working like new. So now let's think how cheaper not highend hw will die during qualifier + add to this mass binning. I don';t think that new faces will appear in it.

K404 says:

I don't send hardware to RMA. I take responsibility for my own actions. The way we treat hardware isn't covered by design, no matter what the marketing says, it's not covered by warranty either. I kill hardware under LN2, it's my own fault. It doesn't matter if something is designed for LN2 or not, the playing field is the same. If everyone uses GTX660 (example) then everyone deals with the same package/PCB/PWM limitations. You know the saying "don't break what you can't replace" Please don't call old hardware shit. It is disrespectful to the Hardware Masters League and also to the people who can not afford better, but still want to enjoy their hobby.

Colombia saint19 says:

I would agree with both of you guys. @Xtreme Addict: I agree with you in almost 90% of things, but I also thing that not always latest hardware is necessary. For my own I think that overclock is a hobby and like a hobby you need money, too much money and that's why I used my credit card for buy a GTX 680 Lightning and 3770k but as you say, let's be honest, even with that hardware I have to be a very lucky guy when the other guys have 4-5 or 6 pieces of the same hardware. @K404: I have seen some competitions with mid end hardware like 660 Ti or 7770 and are also very funny, not top hardware and as you say we don't compete for a WR or something like that, the competition is for the price and the time that you enjoy while compete against others. As I told to xtreme addict, I have very new hardware but I also have old school hardware (7900 GT, 8800, 8600) and those models are excellent to play, get points and learn a lot of things about volt mods, OS configurations and best drivers...personally, some times play with this hw is more fun that with new hw.

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

K404 said: I don't send hardware to RMA. I take responsibility for my own actions. The way we treat hardware isn't covered by design, no matter what the marketing says, it's not covered by warranty either. I kill hardware under LN2, it's my own fault.

It doesn't matter if something is designed for LN2 or not, the playing field is the same. If everyone uses GTX660 (example) then everyone deals with the same package/PCB/PWM limitations. You know the saying "don't break what you can't replace"

Please don't call old hardware shit. It is disrespectful to the Hardware Masters League and also to the people who can not afford better, but still want to enjoy their hobby.


If you don't send HW for RMA - it's your own decision.
If vendor accept HW which I overclocked on LN2 - I am happy. Moreover some vendors help with special privileges for RMA hw which was overclocked on ln2, so why don't use it? RMA is also a support. Some overclockers get all samples of hw for free, some others have to buy everything or almost everything but they have better support with softwares/RMA. To each sold hw, few % of the price is RMA, and with HW more "extreme", warranty costs are bigger added to the $ of the product. If one vendor will reject HW after OC, I would switch to a vendor which accepts warranty. It's simple maths. If you think that it is dishonest - it's your opinion, but in the same way you can say getting free samples for LN2 is also dishonest, cause it's also a support.


I didn't wrote anywhere that old hardware is a shit. I wrote that old hw is without warranty and that's all. Qualifier can't be done on hw which is not produced, not available everywhere. You have to remember that MOA/GOOC/AOOC are the marketing of current available hardware.

I WROTE that I prefer to overclock highends than shits like GTX 660. For me it's a shit and here it's why:
- I will not do global single/multi gpu WR in any 3DMark on it, cause it;s not the fastest option
- I am in PRO CUP now, I was in PRO League - hw points don't count for me and I support my Team by doing results on the newest generations
- if qualifier would be on GTX 660 - I would buy it only for the qualifier and then sell it cause it would be not useful anymore
- it has efficiency of GTX 580? I had a lot of GTX 580 @ LN2, even 4-Way, it;s not fun anymore cause I like big numbers

That's why for me it's a shit cause I prefer now to play Titan. Sometimes truth is harsh. Of course I admire and encourage everyone to overclock, old hw, new hardware and so on. I love overclocking, but there are persons which like to play with cheap old hw and doing gold cups, but I am the one who loves pushing new generations to the limits and see high numbers (3DMarks) or low times (SuperPI). I also showed my point that I don't think that making qualifier with cheaper hw will result in new/unknown overclockers. Last online MOA EMEA qualifier was very tense, 8 WRs was broken during it. It was a very good marketing material for MSI. On cheap hw it wouldn't be interesting...

United States Splave says:

Still owe $5000 on my newegg credit card XD so I have exactly $1200 of credit left to spend :)

Colombia saint19 says:

Splave said: Still owe $5000 on my newegg credit card XD so I have exactly $1200 of credit left to spend :)


Holy shi*** my credit card only have that 1200 as max credit.

One thing that I forgot to mention is: Some of us (including me) have to buy the things on USA and import those things to the country, that increase the cost and reduce the time for the competition.

In my case I can buy on Newegg with my credit card and a friend help me out to send me the things to my country, but that process takes 1 week and a half....not big time, but not the same 2 days free shipping of the US residents.

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

saint19 said: I would agree with both of you guys.

@Xtreme Addict: I agree with you in almost 90% of things, but I also thing that not always latest hardware is necessary. For my own I think that overclock is a hobby and like a hobby you need money, too much money and that's why I used my credit card for buy a GTX 680 Lightning and 3770k but as you say, let's be honest, even with that hardware I have to be a very lucky guy when the other guys have 4-5 or 6 pieces of the same hardware.

@K404: I have seen some competitions with mid end hardware like 660 Ti or 7770 and are also very funny, not top hardware and as you say we don't compete for a WR or something like that, the competition is for the price and the time that you enjoy while compete against others. As I told to xtreme addict, I have very new hardware but I also have old school hardware (7900 GT, 8800, 8600) and those models are excellent to play, get points and learn a lot of things about volt mods, OS configurations and best drivers...personally, some times play with this hw is more fun that with new hw.


I understand those who has limited budget and would love to take part in MOA Grand Final. It's a great experience, a lot of fun. But I am always realistic. I couldn't buy HW in Poland (Lightnings or high end MSI boards) in 2010 or 2011 to participate in Futuremark/HWBOT contests with extra tickets for MOA. There was no hardware available in 2011 (no GTX 580 Lightnings in Poland), and in 2010 I binned Gulftowns but my CPUs were all shits and I couldn't buy a board then so I didn't take part in it at all. That;s why the most important factor is AVAILABILITY OF HARDWARE. In 2012 a miracle appeared and 2 months before MOA EMEA few Lightnings 7970 appeared in Poland... Binning is the part of the game. You have bigger chances with highends and good luck, with cheaper hw it's a mass-binning game.

And we have to remember that marketing is the part of those events. If it has no marketing value - vendors won't do it cause it would be a loss of money. Marketing is important and there are resources for it only for the hw which is produced and sold. There are no marketing budgets for old hardware, where vendors don't earn $ anymore. So old hw is out for 100% in my opinion.

K404 says:

Of course obsolete stuff is not an option :) I would never expect a company to give a modern-day crap about 8800 scores.... but please think about this: if the qualifier has a "cheap" VGA cost for participation and there are weekly prize draws with multiple prizes that cost MORE than the VGA, participation levels should be quite good. At the moment: participants buy a top-end card and have an all-or-nothing chance of winning something, or a weekly prizes that cost a lot less than the cost of entering. We all complain about competitions where the best (e.g.... 680) score wins.... a 680.

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

K404 said: Of course obsolete stuff is not an option :) I would never expect a company to give a modern-day crap about 8800 scores.... but please think about this:

if the qualifier has a "cheap" VGA cost for participation and there are weekly prize draws with multiple prizes that cost MORE than the VGA, participation levels should be quite good.


At the moment: participants buy a top-end card and have an all-or-nothing chance of winning something, or a weekly prizes that cost a lot less than the cost of entering. We all complain about competitions where the best (e.g.... 680) score wins.... a 680.


You are right, if weekly prizes would be nice, more people will take part in it. But overall I wouldn't count that new faces will appear in Final (by new faces I mean - totally unknown overclockers, without strong ln2 results in the past and so on). But more people would do any result for it.

I wrote my opinion that I would prefer to bin high ends which I will use later, but if vendor decides doing qualifier on FM2 & HD7700 I will of course take part and I will do whatever I can to qualify.

BTW

I never complain that I have to use 7970 or 680 to win 7970/680 cause I can use second GPU for multigpu, sell it and so on. I am happy that there are any prizes :D :D

Indonesia Lucky_n00b says:

For me my limit is about 1000 USD to 1500 USD-ish. I rarely bin a lot of hardware by my own, usually 2-3 CPU or 1-2 GPU max.

On a sidenote, IMO it would be nice if the upcoming qualifier for live competition (e.g MOA) is divided into 2(two) categories :
1) The "standard" ones, just like last year, no CPU limits, single GPU, etc.
2) The "Cost/performance" ones, limit the competition to a specific mainstream hardware at the time (e.g GPU is limited to GTX 650 Ti's).

I agree with what Addict's said in the above post, that mediocre hardware will die easier, and some ocers will just bin many of them , and as always, extreme overclockers should stick to the high-end hardware in order to push the limits of its performance (and world records!)

But my point is : there's also a skill involved with overclocking mainstream hardware, for example : those mainstream hardware has less build quality as the high-end, and usually those hardware needs more modification and/or tweaks to get it right before doing an actual benching. And I'd say these overclockers who overclocks mainstream hardware to an extreme level also deserves to be in the same arena along with the Top Extreme Overclockers.

Again, I absolutely agree that the live finals should be a place for Top extreme overclockers, but if overclocking mainstream hardware could get some other overclockers attention,and could promote extreme overclocking to more masses, then it's good for us ,right? ;)

Belgium Massman says:

Interesting reading the replies in this thread. I think you guys will be surprised about what MSI cooked up this time ... quite close to ALL of your suggestions. I see about 60% is €250 and €500 and then there's a big drop-off. Good info!

Poland Xtreme Addict says:

so I guess I should preorder RMA number for 660 GTX???? :D:D:D It will be fun :D Hope MSI will give more tickets this year :D

Colombia saint19 says:

Xtreme Addict said: so I guess I should preorder RMA number for 660 GTX???? :D:D:D

It will be fun :D Hope MSI will give more tickets this year :D


lol...nice suggestion about the RMA.

I hope that too, more tickets would be nice for all participants, more if the rules change.

United States Splave says:

I remember a couple years ago price of admission was just as high, but you did so to participate in a qualifier for your region which was amazing IE las vegas for americas qualfier etc. They have done away with this which I assume has saved them a TON of money over all so why not share that savings by beefing up the prizes and or opening up more slots for the final.

Belgium Massman says:

The ROI on the events in those days was just WAY too low; it was very clear it couldn't last like that. I think the budgets for competitions like MOA are now getting to a normal level, with all structural changes it comes with. I hope the live contests can become financially healty and start growing again :).

Australia Dinos22 says:

uncle fester said:
As to how mucb id spend.... Calculate this,
The exact amount that xyala and trouffman spend when u go to a night club with them......


LMFAO if i was eating a pretzel while reading this, I'd choke on it 100% :D

Brazil Rbuass says:

Since each 1 USD dollar I spent in USA means 2x more in Brazil... for example, the Titan cost about USD 2000 here.
For now, I am benching Titan, after ti give up to buy one and fortunately receive a sample from Zotac (gift).
I like to bench old hardware... just for fun..
I used 8800GTX, 3870, socket 939... E8600 (crazy)... but for my personal preference, I like 3D with High end cards.
Since there are only reference card to Titan, it separate the overclockers by risk.
Who cares to hash and zombified a 2000 USD (or 1000 there)... as the only sample... with LOTS of risk to kill the card?
I only did, because was a gift, and they know the target is to overclock to the max.
If I have to buy one... I will need to think serious about it..
No RMA.. no more normal use... and bench the card to the end... lol
My budget is tiny from what I need... but will effort to the max to can compete with the weapons and tools I have,

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